S3 Ep. 222 Finding Hope in Nigeria: Perspectives from the Next Generation

Speaker 1: Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, good everything. Wherever you are on the surface of the earth this very instant, watching me and listening to me , how are you? I need to ask that question, it's not rhetorical. It means a lot to me because, yes, part of the reason why we are here is because you are there listening to us. So this is the space where we come in to lean on one another's experience to forge a positive path. It has been an amazing, amazing season. So what are we going to be doing today? You're wondering. I'm coming, give me a minute. I have some special guests in the studio with me today Millennials. Ah yes, these ones somehow are with me. I'm responsible somehow for them. And I just told myself, from time to time, we, we gist here and there, and all of that, and I said, okay, I think I should bring them into this space and let us have some time, you know? And, uh, this space is open for everybody. Yes, the good, uh, would I say, the bad and the otherwise and the otherwise. So before I do anything, before we go on, I have Jesse Daniels here with me in the studio and Samuel Amadi. I won't introduce them, I'll allow them to introduce themselves before we go into what we have today. You may call it millennial vibes, millennial gist, whatever you want to call it. They're young adults, they are here with me and we're going to take the gist, you know, and all of that. Let me not preempt what will happen. All right, let's start with Samuel Amadi. Let's get to meet you. Welcome. Thank you very much, sir. Speaker 3: Good day everyone. My name is Samuel Amadi. Let's get to meet you. Welcome. Thank you very much, sir. Good day everyone. My name is Samuel Amadi. I'm a graduate from Landmark University, nigeria. I studied computer science and I'm also a fresh out of the NYSE service in Abuja here. Speaker 1: All right. So what was the experience like ? Speaker 3: It was an experience I can never forget. Speaker 1: You can never forget. So it's part of who you are. Well, hold that thought. We'll come back to that. Alright, JC Daniels, I get to meet you. Speaker 2: Hello everyone. My name is Daniel Daniel Jesse. I'm a graduate of Veritas University, abuja. I studied a graduate of Veritas University, abuja. I studied history and international relations. Speaker 1: Okay. So guys, they are all from Abuja. They're in this space with me today, and when they came on the show, I served them coffee. What was it like? Speaker 2: It was the first time . Speaker 1: First time. Speaker 2: It was nice, nice. Speaker 1: Feels good. So you want was nice. Nice, it feels good. Do you want to indulge? You want to. Let me put a caveat. As they say, cars parked at owner's risk. But no, it's a good thing, there's a good feeling about coffee and when your taste I'm used to. It's not the usual taste you're used to. Okay, can you describe it? Speaker 3: it has this rich not sweet, but rich kind of taste. It's not yeah you know it's not something ordinary it's not ordinary, it's out of this world . Speaker 1: Okay, I like that and you it's. It's for me, it's not something ordinary. Speaker 2: It's not ordinary, it's out of this world. Yeah, from the land. Okay, I like that and you, for me, it's bittersweet. It's bittersweet, yeah, like life Like. Speaker 3: Yeah, pretty much. Speaker 2: Okay. The initial taste has this bitter undertone, but then eventually you become used to it or you begin to enjoy it when it goes down your throat. Speaker 1: Oh, all right, I like that description. This is your experience and you're saying it. And a couple of times on the show, I've told people, as in, I've told the audience and I try to let them know I'm not a coffee addict, I'm a coffee enthusiast. There's something about that. You know, word word, word, word , word Updates. So, guys, you see what I face all the time when I have this discussion with them. So what do you want us to talk about today? I want to make this like your moment, like we're just in. What do you want us? Is there any question? Something you just like? Ah, what do you think? And all of that in between, I'm going to ask my own questions. Speaker 2: Anyway, oh, okay, there's. There's plenty to talk about. Speaker 1: Yes, there's a lot, Okay, but for the time we have, you will try and we'll try and manage the time we have, because there's always another time for us to do that. So plenty, where do you want to start from? Speaker 3: are you ready? Should we shoot? Speaker 2: yeah, shoot shoot. Speaker 3: Yeah, I would like us to address, address the current , you know, topic of Nigerians living the country, the mindset of you know you leave the country and then, like you've made it okay, you can just find yourself outside the borders of this nation, nigeria. Speaker 1: Yeah. Speaker 3: You're set to go for life. Speaker 1: Is that a kind of conversations in your circles going on? Speaker 3: And then I'm not one that supports. I'm not against it, but I'm also a big fan of you know, people leaving the country looking for, in quotes, greener pastures. Okay, so a lot of people just feel like I don't know what I'm saying. Anytime that kind of conversation comes up, I'm usually, you know, being dragged . Ah, don't worry, continue going through what's tipping is showing you and all that all right, so I just want us to address it. am I wrong for believing that? You know there's still hope and if you're hardworking enough you can make it in this country All? Speaker 1: right. Speaker 3: The people who believe that running away is the best solution. The best solution, especially for youth. Speaker 1: I'm going to read out something I wrote this morning and we're going to pick up that conversation. Nigeria, we hail thee, our own dear native land, and we're going to pick up that conversation. It feels as though holding onto these words is like grasping at shadows, an act that feels futile, almost naive. But when I recall the ancient story of the earth, you know, of empires rising from the ashes and people overcoming despair, my spirit is renewed, hope swells again, undeterred, because from the depths of struggle, there is only one way forward upward. And so, with all that I am, I choose to believe in the promise of this land for my nigeria. The path may be steep, but on, but onward and upward. It shall be Something I wrote this morning and I shared it, you know, on my social media. Whatever Is it wrong to think the way you're thinking, it's not wrong. And again, I look at it from the perspective. I mean, I look at it from this angle perspective. Yes, you look at a glass. There's water in the glass. Some of us will see half full, some of us will see half empty. So people think, a good number of us think, that when we leave the country, we have made it. But there's a danger in that. There's a big danger. Nigeria is going through a cycle that, if we're not careful , danger in that. There's a big danger. Nigeria is going through a cycle that if we're not careful, there will be a generational loss. You now have a whole generation of people missing from the landmark or from the geographic called Nigeria. So we are not part of the story . You know the process, the horizon. Do we have challenges? We do. Is it enough for you to run away? Think it twice. You know. Someone said a wise man said, which later was taken into a song he who runs, he lives to fight another day. But come to think of it when you run, without even thinking of the fight for another day. That's it. So I'm not against people living in Nigeria no, I'm not, in all fairness, I'm not. But rather now, I'm not against people living in Nigeria. Okay, no, I'm not, in all fairness, I'm not, but rather now I'm looking at, do you know why you're living? A good number of us think we're living because we're going to a place that works. We're going to a place that will have ease, peace of mind and quote unquote forgetting that somehow you're trading off something. Speaker 3: What are we trading? Speaker 1: You're trading off your history, okay, you're trading off your Safety, your safety. You're trading off your story for another's. Speaker 3: A lot of people would not really consider yes, that's what I'm saying. It's perspective, yeah they have this tunnel vision on making money. Let life be easier for them and also how do you convince people like that, someone that has been through a lot in this country, you know, and then you're telling the person oh, don't leave, don't give up on this country, you're trading off your history. Speaker 1: You're trading off when they know let me say something about convincing somebody. Now, if you see the movie, you guys know I always bring out lessons from movies. Even my audience they know that . When you see the movie, you guys know I always bring out lessons from movies. Yeah, even my audience they know that. When you see the movie uh, what was his name now? Captain america and his team, the justice league. Speaker 3: Okay, the last, the avengers, the avengers. Speaker 1: Yeah, the part two that saw Iron man dying. What was the? Speaker 2: end game. Speaker 1: The end game, thank you. When Dr Strange, because he's like the foreseer who sees into the future and he could not see any option but one. And that option he didn't tell them. The option was that Iron man was going to die. That was what he saw. But he knew if he had said it to them, the fight wouldn't have been possible. So they kept pressurizing him. He said I don't see any other way, it's just one. And when Tony Stark, iron man, came to understand, what he saw was when he came against Thanos and he looked at him because it's like every scenario they played it. They brought the stones to Thanos and Thanos was like I've been looking for this and you guys gave it to me on the platform of whatever. He now turned and looked at Tony Stark and what did he show him? Just one finger. He said that is the option I saw and he understood it immediately and he took it. Sometimes dying is the only way out. Speaker 3: But no one wants to die. Speaker 1: Yes, but everybody wants to leave. Speaker 2: Nigeria is at a point where we need to start dying for our beliefs. Speaker 1: True, I'm not ready to die, you're not ready, but you have to think of it. You get me. It's the same story of the redeemer Christ. His destiny was to die, he lived to die, he lived to die, or everything about him was to die. So imagine Jesus now coming and telling us that, guys, I don't think I can do this so practically we are damned forever. You get me. So it is for this generation to see that sometimes the way out is death. But understanding what death is in this context means a lot. You, you get me. It is not like damnation, it is not like disappearing, it is not like dying dying but it's like saying, sowing something for the future. So I think we need to look at it from that perspective. Even this generation, I don't know, I don't think I can leave out of Nigeria for more than a certain period. I am wired to stay in this place, even if I've lived abroad before. I've stayed abroad for almost two years. There's something about this country that is so amazing. You get me. There's something it's that is so amazing, you get me. There's something. It's not our lawlessness, for your information, it is not our recklessness, but it is our resilience, our ingenuity. Speaker 3: What do you think is a toxic relationship we have with our? Speaker 1: country. I wouldn't call it a toxic relationship. I think a good number of us are living in denial refusing to accept reality as it faces. Yes, we're living in denial. You get me? Okay now let me say this then, jesse, you're going to say you're going to, uh, maybe ask a question or you come up with a thought. There's one nation on earth. I don't know for other nations, but when I read about them I was surprised. They are the only people who run to their country when there's war or when there's trouble guess those people the. Jews. They have this undying belief that those people, israel, the Jews, they have this undying belief that when there's war, that's when they are going back to their yes guys, that's when they are going back to their nation to fight. So you ask yourself this question what are they seeing that we're not seeing this question? What are they seeing that we're not seeing you guys? Speaker 3: are quiet, abi, alright, sincerely speaking, uncle, it would be easier to run back to Israel, if there's more , than to run back to Israel. Speaker 2: To be easier to run back to. Speaker 1: Israel. Speaker 2: I think, based on what you're saying, it's going to be easier. Yeah, it's that mindset of running back to Israel that has made Israel what it is. Speaker 3: Okay, are they running back from way back? That's what. Speaker 2: I'm saying. The fact that I feel like I have to go back home means I have to make home safe enough for me to go back to whenever I want to go back. That's it. Speaker 1: There's nothing wrong you moving out of your country, yeah, but when you can't come back home, it becomes a problem. It becomes a problem, yeah, when you can't come back home and you know what Nature abhors vacuum it does. If you think you're running out , you're playing safe, you're actually creating space for a negative entity or force to take over, yeah, so let me hear your thoughts. You have a question? Speaker 2: yeah, I do so. I, I, I want to. I want us to do a feasibility study in this one minute go ahead this one minute. So I have. I have come to observe that, like people in my generation especially, yeah, the thought processes we have is very, very poor, very, very poor, in the sense that the way we assess or the way we assess damage control nigeria is in a poor state. How do you want to contribute to, like making your space better? So, um, somebody shared a thought with me. He was like oh, if you want to make nigeria better, it has to start with the family. The family in the sense that if every home is able to like train their child the way he should go, as the bible says, then we wouldn't have so many issues. And initially I was like, oh, that's going to take so such a long time because 30 years, 50 years, who has that patience? Yeah. But then I went back and I thought about it and I was like, even if it's going to take such a long time, yeah on a scale of one to ten. How many parents can we count on in my generation to say they would actually raise their children? Yeah the right way, taking an example of like. When my nephews and nieces come back from school, they're telling me things that happen in their class. I'm like and like yeah, that's all they do for their because really it's mind-boggling how parents are able to expose their children to such things. Yeah, yeah. So what? What's it going to take to inform the Nigerian mind that this is what we need to do? Yeah, this is how, or how do we now go about it? Speaker 1: Okay, I will answer that question. Guys, like I said, this session is conversational and I allow them to ask the questions. I will give some answers along the line. They will also bring in their thoughts. So, taking responsibility, responsibility, being accountable, your thought process can only work when you subject yourself, you get me to being accountable. Now let me explain what I mean by that. The the bible described moses as the meekest man on earth, and people don't understand what it means to be meek. Yes, why was moses the meekest man? Or why did the bible describe him as the meekest man on earth? he had temper issues and temper tantrums, and all that. Now, this is the meaning of meekness one who has power and can use the power, but chooses not to use the power. Speaker 2: So why? Speaker 3: do you have the? Speaker 1: power Good, you have the power to do good, but power is neither good nor bad. It is a reflection of the person yielding it or wielding it, I beg your pardon. So you hold yourself accountable? It's like I have a sword with me. I can use the sword, but I choose not to use the sword. So each time I withhold the sword from being used, that is a negative aspect the sword only comes out for good. So, parents, holding yourself accountable, you hold yourself accountable. How do you hold yourself accountable in this generation, so that it reflects on your children? So let me paint a good picture. The social media is so free. It's now freer than the air we breathe. You can access any kind of information you want to access on the social media. Now imagine you telling yourself I will not strain my eyes to picture or to view any inappropriate content. Are you holding yourself accountable? yes do you think that action will reflect on your children? Yes, good, because it will show in your attitude. Yeah, it will show in your expressions. What do I mean by that? You'll not be scared to allow your children pick your phone and play with it, because there's nothing, should I say, unhealthy for them to see. So you hold yourself accountable. That's what you're doing. It reflects on your children and it will tell in other aspects of your being. Can we start from there? That's a question. Hold yourself. That's a question. Hold yourself. Train up a child as he should go. You can only give what you have that's, that's the challenge. Speaker 2: The fact that they can only give what they have in some cases is the case of the devil know better so you ask if you don't know better. Speaker 3: I was about to ask a question. Yeah, go on um in as much as we everyone here are christians. We're talking about a national. Yeah, you know situation and we should also acknowledge the fact that christianity is not the only religion okay in this country, so they didn't make the statement yeah in his question sorry he asked. He said that why can't parents train up their children in the way of the bible? Yeah, you understand the issue there is, some parents don't even believe that what they are doing is wrong. You understand, like certain things, that we might find wrong all right they can find it very , very right, okay, and certain things you can find right, they might find it very wrong. The other yesterday at my place of work, I was having a conversation with my boss and she told me how, in some places in nigeria, yeah to date. They believe in the female genital mutilation and it's still happening, yeah. So I believe that, before we even try to talk about accountability, yeah, and responsibility, yeah our belief system is an issue, okay, and if we can solve that issue, you know, I know many people will be like who defines what is right? who defines what is wrong? I don't know who defines what right and wrong. I don't want to know okay well, I believe that if we can change our belief system, dropping religion aside and just knowing what's good and what's wrong, yeah then we can go ahead that's so. Speaker 1: So I, I, I quite appreciate that thought of christianity you just raised now . But we're not. This is not christianity, this is not a religious conversation. You know a lot of people come to say, oh, because we're christians, we do this, we do that. Speaker 2: Okay, fine, no problem but do you know that? Speaker 1: the very nature all around you points to you being accountable. Speaker 2: Yes. Speaker 1: There is a moral compass within every man, woman, man. Now it's mankind working the earth. Yeah, so we choose. To listen or not to listen is a choice, you get me. The very nature around us, the birds, the plants, the animals, the cycle of the earth, speaks to a balance that, when you respect that balance, you're going to see the wisdom reflecting in your actions. But when you have a seared conscience, a reprobate mind, a mind that tends to wickedness, wapness, what you begin to see is negative. A mind that tends to wickedness , wapness, what you begin to see is negative. That's, what you begin to see is negative. Speaker 2: To buttress what you just said. Recently I read that in Japan and I think it's something China is beginning to adopt. When children begin school from zero to six years, they don't do anything academic in school. You go to school to just basically learn manners and like how to behave around people. Yeah, that's all you learn manners. Speaker 3: It's very underrated topic in this country. Speaker 1: Yeah, you learn manners simple, good morning simple hi very underrated, open the door for me, you clean up before you begin to learn all the mathematical principles. And what have you? You get me. You're not just academic character, you're wise. That is what is called wisdom. You are wise. So these things are not gradually, would I say, disappearing from our society. So we need to bring them back, hold yourself accountable you hold yourself. What sort of practices are you doing? Sharp practices in your business. So there's something a lot of us don't see, but if you look carefully you see it. Our lives are not fragmented. Our lives are not segmented. People try to live segmented lives like okay, what I do at work is different from what I do in the office. It's what I do, different from and all that no. Speaker 2: Nature. Speaker 1: Nature, nature, god's creation called nature, does not have amnesia, because what you do behind closed doors, nature records it and sure one day nature will expose it in the open. Do you know why? God cannot be mocked? Whatsoever a man sows, he will reap. So when your life is lived as though, what I do in the secret I can comfortably do it in the open, that's accountability. Speaker 2: That makes a lot of sense you know, the crazy thing is what you are saying now. There's tons of messages social media has been saturated with people used to justify themselves Because what you just said, that you just clicked in my head, I've seen people saying oh, I'm a different person to different people. I relate with you based on your personality. Oh, in church, I'm a different person. At home, I'm that person. At work, I'm that person. Speaker 1: He's a person. Bipolar Zodiac. Speaker 2: Capricorn Cancer Sagittarius. How. Speaker 3: Sagittarius relates to Capricorn is different from how. Speaker 2: Where did we get all those? Speaker 1: things from. Speaker 2: I don't know when did we get all those? I don't know where did we get all those. Speaker 1: that's justified that's more like coming up with an idea to reinforce your ignorance and your negativity. You get me, okay? Somebody will say, ah, you don't believe in the zodiac signs and all that. And I always ask the question where did you get it from? Speaker 3: Just even say the trending like no. Speaker 1: It's not just trending, it's been there. It's been heightened by social media. The question is where did you get it from? Who originated the zodiac sign, the stars as we call it? Oh, the study of astrology, the study of astrology, you get where they did come from. If you can understand the origin of things, then you can determine where it's going. If an evil man comes to paint a good picture, forget it. The end of his painting will reveal his evilness. You understand it will reveal his. You can't give what you don't have, so let me give us. Let me tell us something about the Zodiac that a lot of people don't pay attention to. They'll say even the wise men you know they even saw blah, blah, blah. Speaker 2: Okay sorry. Speaker 1: Please can you read that scripture? Well, they saw the star of a king, hmm, yeah, so because they saw the star of a king, you now ride on that knowledge to create your own stars and interpret them. Now let's see something God speaks to us through nature, because why he created nature? He created nature. He created nature. Now, those three are, sorry, the major, not three, sorry, the wise men. They were not, they were more than three. Yes, they were godly people, godly men, you get me, but their knowledge. They got so many inspiration, intelligence from studying of the creation and they got information, scientific knowledge that was revealed by divinity. This is how I define scientific knowledge. Scientific knowledge is divine knowledge reviewed. I agree, and divine knowledge is scientific knowledge yet to be reviewed. You get me. So now he taught them according to this. I want to show you like you show me a sign, kind of thing. It's okay, this is a sign that someone great is coming, but you don't pick the sign and run without the signature or the one who signs it. You get me, yeah, so that is the problem. So now, astrologers, the study of the stars, the cosmos, now you know that, according to scientific knowledge, when a particular we are in the Milky Way, our galaxy it's called the Milky Way. There are tons of them out there, and you now see that when the stars align in certain pattern, a certain current comes in certain seasons, according to the timing of the earth. Because the earth runs on a timing, you get me. So okay, from January to so so, and so the north easterly wind will blow, or the Western, whatever trade winds will come, creating so-so and so, because you have done it over and over again, you now build a consciousness around it and all of a sudden, you forget the one who created it and you start worshiping the created. That's the problem of zodiac signs. That's the problem. Soiac signs that's the problem. So you now see again people who understand control and power. That is, uh, what do you call them? Empires? They understand control and powers. They pick these things and infuse their ideology and for their ideology to hold, they create a theology. So they tell you the gods. So you begin to create Capricorn Cancer. They use certain elements of creation Pisces. Speaker 2: Symbols Pisces is what Fishces. Symbols Pisces is what fish? Yeah, pisces is fish, fish match. Speaker 1: Sagittarius, you know , excuse me, we were created in his image likeness that is animalism. So you see now, but because it is like what is prevalent, yes, appealing in the propagation of their empire. So all of us tend to. Now, if you look at the life of Abraham, there's something fascinating about Abraham in his day and time. So all of us tend to. Now, if you look at the life of Abraham, there's something fascinating about Abraham In his day and time. There was idol worship and all of that. But have you ever paused to ask yourself why did God single him out? Why, actually, Because he had a different mindset. He just felt this idol we're worshiping it's not it. God saw him and said this is the person I need and picked him out. I see what the scriptures. If you go to the scriptures and read carefully, he said I know Abraham, for he will what? Instruct his children not after himself, but after the ways of who the Lord. God said that's the man. Speaker 2: So how did he know the ways of the Lord? Speaker 1: How did he interact with the Lord? Speaker 3: So God revealed himself. Speaker 2: Yes. Speaker 1: God is hidden from humanity. When I mean hidden from humanity, god loves to be sought after. He likes when we search for him . He likes when we seek him you get. So in seeking him, he reveals himself to you and human nature, the way God wired us. We are systemic in our thinking . Yesterday I went through this road and this happened. The other day, I went through this road and this happened. Three weeks ago. I went through this road and this happened. It becomes a pattern. You just tell yourself tomorrow , when I go through here, this will happen, but it's not always the case. You get me. So we need to see it from that perspective and the minute we see it, you can be a lone voice. It can be quite lonely, like Abraham. You're moving against the grade . Everybody is going in this direction. You're the only one going in the opposite direction and they will tell you now you're on bad pass. Sorry guys, this is Nigeria. They're like what's wrong with you, guys? They say you're telling them I'm seeing something. I say I don't know. So, as a Nigerian, you need to see it, okay. So, guys, you see the kind of discussions I have with them, yes, so what do you have to say? Go on, hit me. I'm trying to digest, you're trying to digest it, I You're trying to digest it, I see. So you know your generation can be termed as generation rescue. Speaker 3: Huh. Generation rescue I think we need the rescue. No, you need to rescue Nigeria. I doubt. No, you don't doubt it. Speaker 2: I'm telling you now I agree. I agree, uncle. Yes, I doubt, don't doubt it. I'm telling you now I agree. Speaker 3: Uncle. Yes, I doubt it. Don't doubt it. Maybe you won't have the oath. Speaker 2: No, so there's something I want to put across. I've been thinking about it, yeah, so I've been doing the research to find out, like, how global power moves. So it started in egypt. It was in egypt for almost 5 000 years. Yeah, then it moves to europe, then it moves to north america. So now we've been, I've been thinking about it. Yeah, usually for global power to shift, about it yeah, usually for global power to shift strategically, there's always an export of people. Yeah, to the next place now. I was thinking about africa in this present phase, the amount of africans who have left africa , who have become parts of systems that, in quote, work, and then it's like it was like zionist movement when they wanted to rebuild israel yeah and then everybody was like, oh, we need to go back to our hometown. Yeah, so now, if I don't know if anybody else has seen it, but there's this urge to like, oh, what's happening in africa? How do we bring africa to be what, what Africa is supposed to be? Yeah, and I saw a group of young Nigerians in the UK who were talking about coming back home to set up businesses and stuff like that. I think these guys the Pistach Mafia is part of that group. I'm not so sure, but I think so . So it's like, oh, I was thinking about it so it's it's like oh, I was thinking about it . So does that mean in the next 50 to 60 years there's, there's going to be an upsurge of like businesses and like like-minded individuals coming back home to like say this is what we want to achieve in our home yeah, at 60 years, to our age. So that's that's. That's why. Speaker 3: That's why that's why I said dying for our beliefs yeah, see, yeah, yeah, in as much as I understand what the angel said, it makes a lot of sense. Yeah, but my problem is this mentality he has. You know of thinking about. You know making impact. You understand it is not what people in my generation are focusing on. Speaker 1: What are they focusing? Speaker 3: on Making money. No, it's not even making money. Ask this is what the average young boy in his early twenties is thinking of the next party to go for. I'm serious, I agree, Thinking of the next party to go for. I'm serious, I agree, thinking of the next GLE to buy or JLK, the average young girl in her 20s, early 20s she's thinking of how she'll get the next iPhone. Speaker 1: Let me differ. You're speaking from your narrative. Speaker 3: Like you said, the social media it's everywhere, you don't? Speaker 1: have a full knowledge of the social media. Okay, there are space. I call it space within the space or spaces within the space . Speaker 2: Okay. Speaker 1: Social media is very broad. Yes, the algorithm is pushing up certain conversations which, more often than not, are negative conversations. Why? Because the negative sells faster. You get me. You don't have the 360 degree view of your generation. You have an aspect which is bordering you and I like that. But I can tell you that there is another group who are sleepless. Yes, and they are like how do we change the narrative? How do we come into that space? You get me. And they are looking for themselves. They are looking for themselves . They are looking for themselves , just like the birth of Jesus and the birth of John the Baptist. You know, john the Baptist and Jesus, they were all the same age. They were born in the same year , if you want to put it on a timeline, the same year, maybe months apart. You get me. But when Elizabeth saw who Mary , mary, what happened? There was this resonance, the baby leaped. It's like I've sinned. But you know what happened when they saw themselves in time and space, john at the time sent people to go and say go and ask that, my cousin, are you sure you're the Christ? Because apparently it was like what's this guy doing? He's meant to come and send me in prison. But Jesus, who understood the principle, said you're not meant to be. That's the end of you. You die. That's your job. That's harsh, harsh, but reality, you get me. So that's it. There are people I've heard about, dk Chukwu Mirije, the convener of Made in Nigeria. He's been on that journey for over 10 years. He's not relenting. He keeps talking about Nigeria in such a way that now he has a center here in Abuja. So when we young people go there to listen to Dike People who don't go to the parties you're talking about, I didn't say everyone. No, we're talking. It's a conversation. You get me, I'm not accusing you. Speaker 2: Okay. Speaker 1: I know they are there , but do you know what? Dk will always say something that I love Timing. When you miss the window, it may not come again. That's the fear. No, that should be your faith. Speaker 3: That we don't miss the window. Speaker 1: Yes, that window. That's why I said you are generation rescue If you think there's another generation coming to save Nigeria. I doubt, I doubt. And somebody, why do you say that? Let me behave like the Magi. I see the star, I've read the star and the star is telling me, from what I read, this generation is their responsibility, because the war generation, the people who saw, who fought the war in Nigeria, almost all of them in two years time, they are all dead. They are gone from the sea. I'm telling you no, no, no, the statistics are there. Yeah, I agree, I agree. Speaker 2: You get me? Speaker 1: No, we're not giving them any time. It's there Statistics. I'm not the one. Most of them are above 80 years of age. Speaker 2: They are above 80 years of age. The challenge on dads now is the principle of what our fathers taught us. There are a lot of people who believe in what their fathers have taught them. Speaker 3: Yes. Speaker 1: Now. So you need to challenge what your father taught you. Speaker 2: That takes a lot of. Speaker 1: It takes a lot of courage. You understand me, but if you must get to the El Dorado, the promised land, you need to fight it. You need to fight it in a good way. You get me. Now let me tell you something, even from scriptures, from our belief system nobody gives power . Speaker 2: Yes. Speaker 1: Nobody gives power. Speaker 2: Power is taken. Speaker 1: Power is taken. So you ask yourself now, how do I take the power? If you take power through violence, you will lose it also through violence, but if you take power through peace, the prince of peace maintains it. Hmm, that's the truth. When Jesus came if you remember , go through the scriptures very well he came to take power. I hope you know that. So the devil showed him another way of taking power. And what did he tell him? Nah, I don't. We don't think. If I follow this route, the power plus me will be taken in the future, I won't follow this one. No, I won't. So what are you going to do? He said I will go through the way of peace. You know the way of peace. When you talk about the way of peace, people think the way of peace. You know the way of peace. When you talk about the way of peace, people think the way of peace is without a battle, is without a fight. This is the way of peace. Enforcing the truth that's the way of peace, not all course. Yes, enforcing the truth. Speaker 3: So, in the process of avoiding war, violence of peace , Not all costs. Yes, Enforcing the truth, so in the process of avoiding war violence the process of enforcing the truth can result to war. Speaker 1: No, Are you sure? I'm completely sure. Speaker 3: What about the people that would like to oppose that truth? Speaker 1: Huh, it's your opinion, huh Is your opinion. Is your opinion, people who resort to violence, it's because they are weak in their thinking . Have you seen two people fighting over something and one comes up with a superior argument, wisely putting his point? The weaker one sees that quote and unquote, he's losing. Shouting his understatement, he will just create one violent thing. Before you know it, the place has scattered he has scattered the whole place. The place is in disarray and all that. And it's like Adi and Epu ask themselves what did this guy actually do to us? That's because his mental capacity is low the way. Look at the life of Nelson Mandela. We may not like it the way he went about it, but I read that book, the Long Walk to Freedom. That was a good book. Do you know that at the time Mandela became violent? Speaker 2: yes, the after the other party, after the ANC yeah. I've forgotten those people's names. Speaker 1: They were the younger , the younger generation they were like they talk about bus, bus here. But you see now it didn't turn out anyway. What happened? Speaker 3: Freedom at last. Speaker 2: No, superior force, Superior force. Speaker 1: We have to go back to the ANC again, but there's yes, but you must not lose sight of the sacrifice that follows it. You must not lose sight of the sacrifice that follows it. Guys, I've been having this lovely conversation with Jesse Daniels and Samuel Amadi. You know they are the millennials. You know we're talking about our country. We're talking about Nigeria and how best to go about salvaging the country. You will agree with me it looks like there's no hope that there is. I wish I can keep them here on for us to talk and all of that more, but for the sake of time I I'll bring them back and we're going to have, you know, further conversations around this. So okay, before we go, I want to. I want to read something, another piece that is not mine, but I got it from somewhere and I think we should look at it from the place of nation building and why we should pay attention. Abraham Lincoln. History prefers legends to men. It prefers nobility to brutality. So are in speeches to quiet deeds. History remembers the battle but forgets the blood. Whatever history remembers of me, if it remembers me at all, it shall only remember a fraction of the truth, for whatever else I am a husband, a lawyer, a president I shall always think of myself first and foremost as a hunter. Those were the words of Abraham Lincoln. Yes, a hunter. History remembers him as one name, one force that stood against slavery, the abolition and all of that, and he was killed. He gave himself up for it. He was not hunted, but he was a hunter. So what will history remember you by? Or as the one who stood idly by when Nigeria needed him or her the most, or the one who heard the clarion call from Nigeria and stood and fought with her side by side Guys. You know how we say it on the show. I wish I could go on and on, but this is what this episode has brought to you Nationhood building our nation. You've heard it from two gentlemen, millennials. I believe their perspective resonates with some of you, if not all of you. Nigeria is not beyond redeeming , we're not beyond redeeming. Before you go up, you have to go down a seed for it to grow and sprout and become that oak tree, very big, creating that shade. And all of that must first die in the darkness. But that's not the end of the seed. All right, guys, go ahead. My producer will always tell me . Don't forget to tell them this. Yes, follow us on our social media handles x, instagram, uh, linkedin, what else again? Facebook, all at amakri iso. One word yes, click that notification button on our youtube channel. Have you subscribed? Go ahead and do that, because this space has a lot to offer. Till I come your way again, my name is amakri. Amakri subuhi. You know how we say it. Speaker 2: Bye for now, guys bye guys, bye guys, thanks for having us.